rolling roads

[TimGR]

Interesting arcticle here on torque:

http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/POWER2.htm

[black x pack]

well yep,i cant argue with that,i dont really understand torque figures etc. so i've not made up a figure. all it must be is that slark's number must be wrong.so when i cant get hold of them i will ask .meanwhile i'll get me coat.wish i hadn't said any thing now

all i want to say to richy on this subject is , that if you are happy with the way the the engine was set up and the way it performs on the road and track , then that is all that MATTERS........ sod what anyone else thinks !! its your car and as long as your having fun with it F##K EM ALL

[Darran]

rolly heads.

well yep,i cant argue with that,i dont really understand torque figures etc. so i've not made up a figure. all it must be is that slark's number must be wrong.so when i cant get hold of them i will ask .meanwhile i'll get me coat.wish i hadn't said any thing now

Im not having a pop
Your head was done by the best pinto head man ever!!!!

I had a similar spec ht engine a few years ago and it was great.
Good useable power...i used it everyday for a couple of years!!

[gary@retro]

The way an N/A engine produces torque gives an average figure of torque per litre. 8 valves slightly less than than 16 valves
Modern ECU's also increase the torque figure lower down as the AFR and spark are more finely controlled

Back in the day the the torque per litre was known as the BS figure ..

"my 2000cc cammed up singing and dancing 8valver made 210ft/lb "

"b*******t " would be the reply

As an example lets go for an engine that is always called a torquey lump ...
The Essex V6 .. 3000cc and 150 ft/lb , thats only 50ft/lb pr litre

N/A formula one engines .. 3000cc and 285 ft/lb

Super tourers had the best torque figures for any engine .. around the 100ft/lb per litre

As for the duratec's, yes the 2.3's and 2.5's are making 220ft/lb
But the 2000cc 304bhp from SBD made 195ft/lb
Despite what some people on forums say, the engine builders arnt claiming more than 100ft/lb per litre

2L x95ft/lb = 190
2.3 x95 = 218.5
2.5 x95 = 237.5

The good old pinto rarely makes over 75 ft/lb per litre .. some get up to 80 but thats an exceptional engine.

As for someone saying that............
" So torque isn't capacity related after all it's air volume pumping related instead then "

Volume and capacity ... hmmm

But ... and its a big BUT !!!!

It dosn't matter what numbers the engines make at so and so's dyno ... its wether you went in with figure 'A' and came out with figure 'A + '

As long as you get a gain after work done, and the car drives better then it dosnt matter what the numbers say compared to another dyno .. your not a car manufacturer that will have law suites if they give the wrong figures for their engines.

Peak BHP and peak Torque figures mean nothing in the real world .. its pub talk (now forum talk instead of the pubs) The thing that makes a quick road car is the area under the curve..
if you have 2 identical cars

car a ... 1000rpm= 80ft/lb 3000rpm= 100ft/lb 6000rpm= 130ft/lb 8000rpm= 170ft/lb

car b ... 1000rpm= 90ft/lb 3000rpm = 120ft/lb 6000rpm= 150ft/lb 8000rpm= 160ft/lb

Car B will be the quicker car on the road even though it has a lower peak ft/lb reading (which will also be a lower bhp fig)

Its a case of .. 'my one may be a little shorter than yours , but its a hell of a lot fatter' winning in the real world. So dont go worrying about peak figures.

You can't go and have a go at a bloke because hes put up what the rolling road told him, go and have a go at the rolling road if you must have a go.

[mk1gaz]

So if torque is "capacity" related and not "air pumping volume" related how comes slapping on a turbo or supercharger ups the torque figuire then ?

[graham John]

**** !

i ONLY asked what the torque figure was








cheeRS

[mk1gaz]

As for the duratec's, yes the 2.3's and 2.5's are making 220ft/lb
But the 2000cc 304bhp from SBD made 195ft/lb

The 195ibs/ft from a 2 litre duratec is only proven on the 1 dyno isn't it ? So we all know what that means don't we ? For example = If they test it on 10 dynos it would make 10 different torque readings wouldn't it ? Have they got a Dyno-Dynamics rolling road torque reading for it i wonder ? If they have then was it in 3rd gear and were the air temp and the intake air temps within 10-ish degrees of each other ? If the air temps are further apart than that then the power + torque readings will go upwards at a fair rate , i know because we've done it !!!!!!!

[plentysideways]

I thoght torque was also affected by the bore/stroke ratio? ie long stroke or undersquare engines were more torquey than short stroke / oversquare ones

End of the day, does it really matter, as long as the car goes better now than it did before?

[TimGR]

One final comment on torque. F1 engines (2.4) are making around 210 ftlbs of torque.....

[mk1gaz]

One final comment on torque. F1 engines (2.4) are making around 210 ftlbs of torque.....

Blimey , less than all these 4 cylinder 2.3 duratecs then (or so they reckon) .

[richy c]

**** !

i ONLY asked what the torque figure was








cheeRS

yeah this is all your fault, ive never given the torque route a thought before.anyway it went well at coombe out done a 5.7 L v8 austin healy, down a straight

[richy c]

spoke to slark speed today,the figure i put up was wrongbut i didnt know.the correct figure is 148lb. which is still good. the reason for the high figure is to do with there air temp sensor or something.so sorry for the mix up(why am i saying sorry?) GJ ITS YOUR FAULT.

[steve p]

It doesn't matter what it is Rich the car went like s**t off a stick at Combe and put some more expensive 'sportscars' to shame!
Steve
P.s. I wish I had been a trailer queen now the weekend cost me £118 in fuel

[gary@retro]

So if torque is "capacity" related and not "air pumping volume" related how comes slapping on a turbo or supercharger ups the torque figuire then ?

Gaz, capacity and volumn is the same thing

Hence why turbo or SC engines get slapped with a capacity multiplier

[mk1gaz]

Gaz, capacity and volumn is the same thing

No it's not , a 2 litre is still a 2 litre but it will get fed more air if a turbo is slapped on it so the bhp + torque will go up not the capacity .
They only have different race classes because a turbo is a power adder and therefore cheating !!!!!!!!