Rubber Petrol Hoses

[Frosticles]

This really is Sh1te. The Government approve this fuel knowing that it will lead to fires??? I for one obviously have first hand experience of this and find it truly shocking.

[rwdrs]

I know it's American but some interesting stuff from Gates. They need to start selling it here. It seems we only get the crap stuff in the UK.

http://www.gates.com/brochure.cfm?brochure=12468&location_id=5348

John

Gates are having their own problems

[rwdrs]

This really is Sh1te. The Government approve this fuel knowing that it will lead to fires??? I for one obviously have first hand experience of this and find it truly shocking.

It was mainly the German motor manufacturers that lobbied the German government and Brussels. The rest as they say is history...

Nowt much that the UK gov' can do about it once it becomes a Directive, it has to be implemented...

[garthbtp]

An interesting article from the US who have had E10 for a while now.

http://classiccars.about.com/od/maintenancetips/a/Ethanol.htm

[Frosticles]

Nowt much that the UK gov' can do about it once it becomes a Directive, it has to be implemented...

I would thought that they would have a moral obligation to warn the owners of older cars of the potential danger.

[garthbtp]

Another interesting article.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/9108430/The-ethanol-threat-to-classic-cars-and-bikes.html

[garthbtp]

Apparently at this time 4 star which is still sold does not contain ethanol although they are looking at trying to put 5% ethanol in.

Thanks Garthy.

[TugsW]

I would thought that they would have a moral obligation to warn the owners of older cars of the potential danger.

Have you had a bang on the head or something

[rwdrs]

I would thought that they would have a moral obligation to warn the owners of older cars of the potential danger.

To be fair, I'd have thought the EU / UK gov. should have a moral and legal obligation to test stuff like this before imposing it on us all...

Bloody EU, just too much power with too little accountability.

I suggest that someone gets up a government "e-petition" to get this debated in the commons and lobby groups like the AA and RAC to turn the heat up on the politicians here and in Brussels. Also a couple of stern letters to your local euro MP, otherwise nothing will change and the man in the street will be forced to bear the brunt of the costs of insurance and/or repairs.

Also letters to the petrol companies to get them to allow them to sell "normal" petrol to classic car enthusiasts etc.

[Tim]

Major traffic jam in Croydon town centre on way home from work tonight . Get to the cause and there's a mk2 Escort on fire !!!!!!!!
Any bets on what started it ?

http://www.thisiscroydontoday.co.uk/Car-Croydon-causes-delays/story-16478423-detail/story.html

and to quote someone off osf

it belonged to an elderly couple.
the truth is the car caught fire around a year ago it burnt the loom under bonnet and so on they gave it to a muppet funnaly enough is name was w-a-y-n-e. a right prick [ i wont go into why] who took a year to fix it they picked it up yestaday morning after paying him a approx 2 bags of sand they got as far as park hill road and oopps he never fixed it very well. the last i heard they were gonna sue the prick good on erm

[kas750]

Having a few old bikes the ethanol in fuel has been a problem for a couple of years.Super unleaded generally doesn't have ethanol added and thats what i use,without any problems to date.Total fuel also almost exclusively sell regular unleaded which is E0..This is a link to the sites that it is available from.

http://www.groups.tr-register.co.uk/wessex/docs/TOTAL%20E0%20Fuel%20Sites.xls

[flyingpilot]

Having a few old bikes the ethanol in fuel has been a problem for a couple of years.Super unleaded generally doesn't have ethanol added and thats what i use,without any problems to date.Total fuel also almost exclusively sell regular unleaded which is E0..This is a link to the sites that it is available from.
http://www.groups.tr-register.co.uk/...el%20Sites.xls

Our local garage is a Total and i asked the question today and he told me all Total fuel has 5% ethanol, even super, infact he said it's illegal for him to sell any petrol that doesn't have ethanol in it.
He also mentioned the industry is fighting the increase to 10% though.

[kas750]

i'll get me coat..

[TugsW]

Having a few old bikes the ethanol in fuel has been a problem for a couple of years.Super unleaded generally doesn't have ethanol added and thats what i use,without any problems to date.Total fuel also almost exclusively sell regular unleaded which is E0..

I worked in a oil refinery until last week and 'theloudboy' who chauffeurs the stuff about have both said that ethanol is added to all gasoline before it is delivered to the pumps in Europe due to the law....And that is all the service stations in the UK Shell,BP,Total,Murco,Esso,Supermarkets,Indies and anyone else I've missed off....

Also gasoline is just not made up from a cut of crude oil in a distillation column, its lots of different carbon chains blended together to make what we call petrol..the blend changes from summer spec to winter spec, the winter blend can have more 'light end hydrocarbons' in it, this maximises profit for a refinery (not enough to keep Coryton open where I worked in profit though).

My job was to maintain the analysers that made sure the fuel was to specification, so I'm not some keyboard jockey...

Copy and pasted from UKPIA site for anyone who is interested about Biofuel :-

In Petrol the standard for bioethanol is EN 15376.

The use of bioethanol in petrol presents some particular problems as it picks up water and moisture during transportation and storage. As a result, it may be preferable in the case of refineries linked to product pipelines, to blend bioethanol and petrol at the point at which road tankers are loaded rather than at the refinery itself. In addition, changes to tanks at filling stations will be necessary. The higher vapour pressure of ethanol could also make it difficult to keep the level, when blended with petrol, within the limits laid down by legislation. For this reason widespread introduction of bioethanol into the UK market continues to require investment at road loading terminals to introduce new blending and storage facilities.

Biofuels are normally more expensive to produce than conventional petrol or diesel so their addition to petrol and diesel would increase the pump price.

In October 2007, Parliament approved the Renewable Transport Fuel Obligation (RTFO), requiring suppliers of road fuels to incorporate a proportion of biofuel in petrol or diesel. The Renewable Fuels Agency (RFA), established on 26 October 2007, has been responsible for monitoring the implementation of the RTFO by obligated companies until 1 April 2011, when the Department of Transport took over responsibility for the governance of the RTFO. Each year guidance notes are issued on how to report carbon saved and sustainability of biofuels.

The RTFO commenced in April 2008 with a target of 2.5% biofuel content in road fuels in 2008/9. On 28 January 2009, the Renewable Transport Fuel Obligation was revised and new limits were announced. The yearly obligation level for fuel suppliers under the RTFO became: 3.25% for 15th April 2009/ 14th April 2010; 3.5% for 2010/11; 4% for 2011/12; 4.5% for 2012/13; 5% for 2013/14. The new levels are in line with the recommendations in the Gallagher Review of Biofuels in 2008, advising a slowing down in the rate of increase of biofuel content in road fuels to reach 5% in 2013/14. The original RTFO targets envisaged a biofuel content of 3.75% in 2009/10 rising to 5% in 2010/11.

The RTFO was amended in December 2011 to reflect the requirements of the Renewable Energy Directive (RED, 2009/28/EC). The RED came into force and required that all biofuels crossing the duty point should meet the carbon and sustainability criteria as defined in the Directive.

On 1 April 2010, following the ending of the duty differential for biofuels for road use, the duty rates for biodiesel and bioethanol have been increased to the same rate as the main road fuels, with a current buy-out penalty for suppliers failing to meet the obligation of 30p per litre. Though, biodiesel made from waste cooking oil will continue to benefit from a 20p per litre duty differential until 31 March 2012.

The UK does have the capability to replace some of the 49.5 billion litres of petrol and diesel used in the UK each year, perhaps up to 10% by volume. Aside from the points mentioned above, a significant limiting factor is the availability of arable land without displacing crops for food production. Land use, indirect land use change (iLUC) and sustainability of remain major issues for the use of biofuel.

[cossie si]

Not much use for standard cars, but i use the new msa regulation Teflon braided hose, which also stops the fuel vapour in the cabin, bleeding through the rubber hose.This, apparently is resistant to most fuels. Would appear the ethanol only damages certain older alloys/metals anyway. Those with electric fuel pumps could start the car , switch off the pump and wait for the engine to use any fuel left in the carbs, not sure it would remove all though.