View Full Version : Poll - Important point, please read !
OK, there is a bit of an 'argument' going on at the moment between Paul (RS2000&Mexico) and myself plus a few others on the subject of the sale of logbooks and tags to be used on non RS cars.
Paul believes that this action should be supported as he thinks it gets more cars on the road. I (and others) on the other hand believe that if we did all we can to discourage people from buying tags then we would end up preserving the genuine cars already on the road.
Please have a read of the last 10 or so posts on this post :
http://bbs.fzr1000exup.org.uk/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?p=22678#22678
Then have a vote.
Cheers
Arron.
Can't seem to make the poll work - what am I doing wrong ?
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 10:29
only dave can do that i think
Mr Hoarder
14-01-2005, 11:13
This is a subject that has been talked about in the Classic car world for years.
For example "D" type Jaguars - there are claims of authenticity based around a percentage of original components in a complete car, and as such two cars have been suggested as being the rightful claimants to one identity.
One of the cars has the original gearbox and final drive, the other the original engine.
Figure that out.
Logbook and identity sales will continue, as long as there is a demand there will be a supply.
I'm not saying it's right (it is illegal after all) but the facts speak for themselves.
Those of us with original RS cars can only hope that we never find ourselves facing a pile of wreckage and then hoping a service shell is available.
That's me done.
no problem, nice to catch up.
I can see both points in this disagreement
but abt 15 years ago a mate of mine
bought a mk1 rs2000 rolling shell with id
it was mint he was told it had had a brand new shell
from ford a few years b4
cut a long story short
when he went to offer up the g/box
the hole did not line up
this was after he had resprayed it an new stripes
it turned out to be a standard escort
it was still a new shell but not a RS shell
so he sold it an lost a bit of money cos of that
cheers
Neil
Come on, 92 views and only 9 votes !
Deepest Blue
14-01-2005, 16:16
This is a subject that has been talked about in the Classic car world for years.
Logbook and identity sales will continue, as long as there is a demand there will be a supply.
I'm not saying it's right (it is illegal after all) but the facts speak for themselves.
Those of us with original RS cars can only hope that we never find ourselves facing a pile of wreckage and then hoping a service shell is available.
That's me done.
I agree with Rob on this one.
The words: losing, battle & fighting spring to mind!
CheeRS Neil
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 16:26
you are not wrong there m8 if it keeps on...
We may well be fighting a losing battle but at least I am doing nothing to condone the problem.
I'm now intrested to know how RS MKII ESCORT CLUB the stands on this.
Phil ?????
Indeed Kel, will Phil ask the mods to delete posts offering tags and logbooks for sale as is done on the RSOC BBS ?
neilmexico
14-01-2005, 17:00
hi there,
i can understand both points of view here,personally i think its wrong and not right that false/fake id can be obtained in a nut shell with book and tags,id never consider any such actions other than genuine rs vehicles of which i own a few.incidentally a good friend of mine who runs a well known mk1 and mk2 breakers actually surrenders genuine rs2000 mk1 and mk2 logbooks and tags back to dvla swansea,hence making no money out of them for his business,ive seen the letters from dvla his has got back,i think if more people took this stance then we wouldnt be in the situation we are in at the moment,id rather have an old tatty GENUINE RS that requires lots of work but was still original and had chassis numbers to suit and prove etc than have a nice shiney not GENUINE RS which could be anything for want of a better phrase.
thats my view lads,what a big can of worms youve opened there aaron mate,good luck
neil
RS2000CUSTOM
14-01-2005, 17:05
Indeed Kel, will Phil ask the mods to delete posts offering tags and logbooks for sale as is done on the RSOC BBS ?
Arron - when you say mods you mean me ! - lol
I cannot be responsible for all ad's placed on here and neither will I be "The Parts Police"
Selling of I.D's is a debatable subject as is the buying and selling of "rolling shells" with no I.D.
What I will not tolerate on this BB is the personal attacks on anybody (namely) RS2000&MEXICO becase he has sold I.D's in the past and because of that it is his own fault his Mexico got nicked !
Everyone take a chill pill and get back to the serious issues effecting the world today !!!
i.e. When are GAZ W and Paul Spence going to have a love child ?
we not attacking Paul personally, just expressing our feeling to RINGING !!! and the sale of ID's that can only be used for changing the ID of a car.
This activity is completely ILLEGAL, dont think you could debate this in a court of law do you Dave !!!
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 17:59
but there is ringing and reshelling due to rust is this all wrong including the reshell due to rust...?
is it a service shell from ford, the shell you had was a car with genuine ID you putting on another car ID on that car, that is ringing !!!!!
if the shell you are using is so good why no ID on that one !!!
Lost it......... reapply to DVLA for a new one genuine one.
Sold ID before you got it....... why ???, only puts questions in one mind to why.
which ever way you look at it .... its ringing, if you want to do it, its up to you.
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 18:15
so this genuine mexico shell i can get of a m8 that is genuine and he has had the car for 14 years is no good a needs to be scrapped cos its got no id onit do you not think a genuine shell is worth saving..?
RS2000CUSTOM
14-01-2005, 18:22
we not attacking Paul personally, just expressing our feeling to RINGING !!! and the sale of ID's that can only be used for changing the ID of a car.
This activity is completely ILLEGAL, dont think you could debate this in a court of law do you Dave !!!
I agree ringing is illegal !
What I do not agree with is blaming the theft of Pauls Mexico on himself because he has sold ID's in the past !!!!
if its got a Vin/chassis no. (on top hat), go to the DVLA and apply for its genuine papers, get plates remade. Sorted !!!!
but...
putting another lost/destroyed mexico ID on it this shell just makes a ....... just dont know what to say, just stinks.
Dave, I have not, nor has Arron, blamed the theft of Pauls mex on him for anything he does.
Someone here is jumping to conclusions here.
Dave - i don't think anyone was specificly blaming Paul for the loss of his mota more the old people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones syndrome. I'm sure everyone on here was gutted for the guy losing a mota like that to thieving tossers but the point is that while people are selling id's it makes the prospect of nicking rs mk2's more appealing to thieves cos they can id them as another car make plenty profit and not get caught!!
RS2000CUSTOM
14-01-2005, 18:29
Dave, I have not, nor has Arron, blamed the theft of Pauls mex on him for anything he does.
Someone here is jumping to conclusions here.
No conclusions being jumped to by me !
I have had to lock 2 previous threads due to this situation !
http://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gifhttp://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gifhttp://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gifhttp://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gifhttp://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gifhttp://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gifhttp://bbs.rsownersclub.co.uk/images/smilies/rsoc/claps.gif
Not like ford did it with the works cars is it LOL....
I personally don't care if my car is an rs or not anymore. So i trashed it.
New shell time.
I would still use same log book.
I really don't think its that big a deal on a mk 2 ot 1 to be honest.
if its got a Vin/chassis no. (on top hat), go to the DVLA and apply for its genuine papers, get plates remade. Sorted !!!!
but...
putting another lost/destroyed mexico ID on it this shell just makes a ....... just dont know what to say, just stinks.
If you have the papers then the plates mean absolulty fooook all.
LOL - papers mean you own the car, END of.
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 19:50
cheeRS dingy
My mate has found a mint shell....no ID on it LOL
So how does that work then ?
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 19:59
well going buy the mex shell i found they have both got to go to the scrap yard and be crushed...
you not even worth air time Steve.
RS2000&MEXICO
14-01-2005, 20:01
why reply to him then...?!!!!!
you not even worth air time Steve.
Why is that then, cause i have an opinion and an honest one at that ?
You are very loud behind the keyboard aint ya mate, also you lie and are very 2 faced, surely thats the same as ringing a car isn't it ?
we not attacking Paul personally, just expressing our feeling to RINGING !!! and the sale of ID's that can only be used for changing the ID of a car.
This activity is completely ILLEGAL, dont think you could debate this in a court of law do you Dave !!!
I agree ringing is illegal !
What I do not agree with is blaming the theft of Pauls Mexico on himself because he has sold ID's in the past !!!!
I've been out to do the shopping so I am just reading through this thread since I started it off earlier today - haven't got to the end yet but having read the above I would like to state for the record that :
I do not blame Paul for the theft of his car - I just find it a little difficult to have too much sympathy for his situation given the fact that he has involved himself (by his own admission) in the sale of logbooks and tags.
This is just my opinion - nothing more
Why do I lie ?
how am I two faced
I must admit Dingy, I thought that was a bit harsh and rather personal
" When are GAZ W and Paul Spence going to have a love child ?"
Its happened , weve had a little boy :cheers:
Kel, you have been 2 faced about stuff with me in the past and also lied about it.
Guess you deny that also, INCREDIBLE if you do.
Personal ? erm.....
you not even worth air time Steve.
That not a pop then......
Guess you need to be in the "in crowd" on this site to, if you don't agree with everything the MK2 experts say then you get shot down.
THink i will stick with my view.
Your ID, your right to sell it.
you not even worth air time Steve.
Think you might have deserved that retort Dingy
Explain Steve, I can only recall the issue with your regional day where I was miss informed.
God that was close to 2 years ago.
Named him yet ?
Pauls choice mate ...we called him neil ,after his 2nd favorite :cyclopsani:
Banishit
14-01-2005, 20:29
I think this all should stop NOW
I dont believe sellng tags and ID's is right as the car you may buy may not be what you think it is
Thats my End to it
Brian
Like i said, i never forget someone that lies to me and is 2 faced with me regardless of time.
I never made it personal, you did.
I have an opinion, you have yours.
But as LOADS of RS's and WORKS cars aint orignal as they came from factory i think the point that your making is wasted.
Ringing a car.
Usally.
Car is nicked, then ID is cloned or swaped with a written off car.
Transfering a logbook from a beyond repair shell to a brought shell with no ID is not the same thing.
RS2000CUSTOM
14-01-2005, 20:36
Now Now Kidz
Play nicely
I am off to the pub to get pi**ed
Lets hope this thread has fell off the first page without it being locked !
See u all later
:geek:
What lies ?
explain yourself, repeating something to you that I was told from a good source that I had no reason not to believe, is not me directly or deliberately telling you a lie.
Explain how I have been Two faced to you, never been nice to your face and then slagged you off behind your back.
Trickster
14-01-2005, 20:43
Unless the shell u brought had a different I.D at some point then its Ringing surely
What are you on about kel LOL....
I never said you slagged me off....
If you don't know then i aint dragging up my old emails to find the exact stuff that was said, cause i really can't be bothered.
At the end of the day you said one thing to one person then another to another thus the term 2 faced. It doesn't matter that much to be fair, but i never forget LOL You seem to have turned the thread into somert it aint mate, hope i never got to you.
Redkop !!!
issue closed !!
LOL not every bit of gossip comes from lynne LOL....
Its closed is it....PMSL
U really tried to belittle me mate, if i actually knew what you looked like at the time i would have said my peace then. LOL
Like i said i never forget but the fact of the matter is....
My opinion don't mean shite in the mk2 scene so it don't matter anyway :cheers:
Mr Hoarder
14-01-2005, 20:55
I thought I was done, but I'm not now.
Ford Motor company and their competition department at Boreham did indeed RESHELL the cars.
With newly built service shells.
Not 25 year old shells that were made as 1300 populars.
I do understand the logic behind the comment you made Steve, about reshelling a rotten car with a good shell that you have bought fair and square. It's not like a stolen car being "rung" for profit. But it is still illegal, like it or not.
My opinion is;
yes of course its illegal, id tags should not be sold seperately form the shell.
if your shell is ****ed and you want a donor one then fine transfer the plates. But if you ever sell the car you MUST tell any potential buyer that its been reshelled. If you dont you are being a :knob:
cheeRS Ders.
Most rs2000s rust around the strut tops and the chassis number is gone for ever......................so who knows...who cares!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I respect everyones views and their reasons for their views !!
my own view is that tags or id's should not be sold.
short and sweet, because i want to enjoy the forum, i haven't been coming on here long and i really enjoy coming on here mainly for the friendly atmos. and the wealth of info, so lets get back to it !!!
cheers
trouble is some people sell the RS bits to weld on to a shell , and when done right you cant tell
spot the difference anyone ...
well i have read through the replies on here etc and my view is i personally wouldnt be happy buying id for a shell - i have had the oppertunity in the past with a gen avo shell to turn it from a late mex into an rs2, the mex shell was a gen 49 shell that had been rs2'd early in its life, even the log book was changed by the dvlc but the chassis number was for a mex, the car the id was coming from was a totally rotten rs2 but i played it over in my mind and it wasnt for me.
I cn understand people havin rotten cars and wanting to keep hold of them and finding a mint shell to keep theres going but most of the time the id swopping would be used to fake one up and sell it on to some unsuspecting buyer as a gen one, or even worse swopping id's from stolen cars.
Will all know what ford got up to with there shells etc and the cases of restored works cars turing up - one with the log book and one with the original shell and no one can register them.
You can also argue that mk1 and 2 shells were standard shells taken off the production line and were made into heavy duty ones, it must off been a lottery as to with ones got taken off.
I think at the end of the day people will always do what they will and we have to live with that , whilst not agreeing with it.
So maybe its now time to put this to bed and get one with the banter and helpfull side of this forum.
RS2000CUSTOM
15-01-2005, 01:13
cheeRS Vinny for that closing comment and at that the topic is now closed.
Good Night xxx
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